kimokalihi's 91 SS EJ20 Swap

[James614]

I've snapped that thing off my MAP sensor too. It had no effect on how it operates. I even swapped it with an unbroken one and saw zero change.

Car looks awesome btw! You're making think I could pull off a non ABS swap, if I ever found the hard lines

[kimokalihi]

Well, let me warn you James. Its a hell of a project. And I would rated it an 9 on a scale of 1-10 for difficulty/amount of work. The svx non-abs mc is near impossible to find as well. Once you get started on it you better be prepared to commit because its easy to damage your factory parts.

[PhyrraM]

Well, let me warn you James. Its a hell of a project. And I would rated it an 9 on a scale of 1-10 for difficulty/amount of work. The svx non-abs mc is near impossible to find as well. Once you get started on it you better be prepared to commit because its easy to damage your factory parts.

So, why?

Race cars, sure. Track cars, sure.

Daily drivers and street cars? Why?

Now, as you know Kimo, I do stuff like that simply for the challange. However, if it was mine I would be looking to update the ABS to something newer....not remove a valid safety feature. I've driven pretty hard, and with grippy tires the ABS is not intrusive at all. I've even rally crossed a lot and still never thought "this crap has to go!". IMHO, of course.

Are you looking simply to create some free space in the corner? Showcar-ish 'clean' engine bay?

[Dominator]

The engine bay looks good without that hunk of junk pump in that corner. Any estimate of the weight of the parts you removed?

Nice brakes! What calipers did you get for those? Even if it adds some weight, the increased braking torque of moving the clamping area outward will be a huge improvement. The large rotors should be better for heat transfer too.

[Legacy777]

Well josh I drove around with the canister off for over 15k miles and it was almost the same pressure buildup so I don't think its working anyways. What if I just run the hose line into the fender or something?

Did you have the line capped that went into the canister or did you route it back into the intake (where the charcoal canister dumped into)?

I would personally plug off the line before I just left it vent. The reason being is that it is fuel vapors and I'd prefer not to have very flammable fuel vapors collecting any where around my car, especially in the fender!

Plug the line....if you see that pressure is building exceessively, just route it back into the intake line. The canister purge solenoid is going to determine when those vapors get sucked in by the engine. The ECU only allows this under certain conditions, typically steady state cruise, which will have little to no affect on the engine.

[Legacy777]

Somehow in the process I accidently snapped this guy off. Just how important is this piece and what the hell does it do? I imagine it's some type of one day diaphragm and therefore probably pretty important? Anybody got one of these sensors for sale?

That is the pressure exchange solenoid. That cap is more or less a filter. The ECU switches between intake vacuum/pressure and atmosphere to measure ambient pressure to correct fueling for changes in altitude. Leaving that open should have no affect on how the MAP sensor does this, but it could allow for dirt to get in the solenoid and possibly in the MAP sensor.

The mid 90's subarus use the same damn pressure exchange solenoids, so you can probably find one off a mid to late 90's Impreza or Legacy. I'm not sure what they cost new.

[Legacy777]

Kimo,

I'll be interested to hear how you like the brake setup without ABS.

Not having ABS is ok for most of the time when you're in controlled braking situations, but under panic braking situations, not having ABS can be the difference between an accident or not having an accident. Ask me, I know....and it was just after I had "upgraded" my brakes to the WRX front brakes. The brake bias and braking dynamic of the car had changed drastically and locked up much more easily.

So I would certainly encourage you to try some "panic" stops to see how the car responds under those situations and which wheels lock up first. Bigger brakes don't always mean better stopping.

[kimokalihi]

I've never had abs before and they failed me in the snow causing me to hit a tree that I may have been able to avoid without the abs which stopped my brakes from working right when I needed them. It was a very slow accident of probably 15 mph by the time I hit tye tree so I do think had I had better control of the brakes it could have been avoided. Its not a daily driver I just don't trust the abs on this car. Sometimes it would randomly turn the abs light on and I have no idea why. Turning the ignition off and on again made it go away. I feel like the moment I need my brakes the abs is going to malfunction causing increased braking distance and an accident. Maybe not but I'm done with it. To me, this is more predictable and reliable and simpler is better. As a bonus I now have a cleaner, simpler, more functional engine bay and less weight in my car which was probably more than replaced by the added weight of these near-brembo sized rotors and 05 LGT brake swap but every bit helps. If I could delete my sunroof, I would.

Some people may get upset at me for removing the abs but there's plenty of cars on the street with no abs and my other car has no abs so I don't see a problem with it. I will buy some sticky tires and bleed the brakes well and it will probably be a lot safer than my metro so I'm not worried.

[kimokalihi]

Well josh I drove around with the canister off for over 15k miles and it was almost the same pressure buildup so I don't think its working anyways. What if I just run the hose line into the fender or something?

Did you have the line capped that went into the canister or did you route it back into the intake (where the charcoal canister dumped into)?

I would personally plug off the line before I just left it vent. The reason being is that it is fuel vapors and I'd prefer not to have very flammable fuel vapors collecting any where around my car, especially in the fender!

Plug the line....if you see that pressure is building exceessively, just route it back into the intake line. The canister purge solenoid is going to determine when those vapors get sucked in by the engine. The ECU only allows this under certain conditions, typically steady state cruise, which will have little to no affect on the engine.

The lines were all capped the whole time. I finally hunted down the proper canister with the right number of nipples and it didn't help much.

[PhyrraM]

No worries Kimo. I wasn't judging, just asking your reasons/opinions and expressing my thoughts. If my ABS was failing and I couldn't/didn't want to figure it out, I would likely make the same choice. These early systems don't make it easy with crud, cryptic, and proprietary diagnostic tools.

Curious as to your experiences, as I've never seen any negative effects unless it kicks in. My WRX has a programming flaw that in certain circumstances a jarring bump under heavy braking can momentarily release the brakes- most of the time with ass-puckering results. But that only happens when your at the edge of the ABS threshold anyways. Better tires made it basically go away by pushing the ABS threshold higher.

[Alphius]

Well josh I drove around with the canister off for over 15k miles and it was almost the same pressure buildup so I don't think its working anyways. What if I just run the hose line into the fender or something?

Did you have the line capped that went into the canister or did you route it back into the intake (where the charcoal canister dumped into)?

I would personally plug off the line before I just left it vent. The reason being is that it is fuel vapors and I'd prefer not to have very flammable fuel vapors collecting any where around my car, especially in the fender!

Plug the line....if you see that pressure is building exceessively, just route it back into the intake line. The canister purge solenoid is going to determine when those vapors get sucked in by the engine. The ECU only allows this under certain conditions, typically steady state cruise, which will have little to no affect on the engine.

You shouldn't cap the vent line. It serves a very useful purpose in keeping the tank from developing pressure or vacuum. Many cars for years and years simply vented under the car or in the engine bay with no ill effects. You needn't worry about it.

[robertpaige]

While I was talking to Kimo the other day we did have a conversation about the Charcoal Canister..

At a meet the other day, a buddy with t-leggy, can't remember his name on here, but it's a 92 with a 91 front end like CJ has, it's winestone maroon, car has like 400 to the wheels. Anyway we talked about the charcoal canister, I asked and he said he just lets his vent right at the hard line in the engine bay and it's been totally fine forever now. I took mine out the other day and haven't noticed anything so far (besides more room in my bay.)

There are so many mixed opinions on this topic, I'd really like to figure out a solution to this. Whether it's harmful to the car is my main concern.. or will cause problems..

[Alphius]

It will not cause problems. I have had the tank vent open with a small filter on the end on my Camaro for as long as I've owned it, as have many other people. You just don't want to cap it, as that will lead to vacuum or pressure in the tank which causes problems.

[kimokalihi]

Which line is it? The big one or small one? Sounds like putting it into the intake is the best option to me.

[Alphius]

Putting it into the intake is a poor choice. Just put a tiny filter on the end and leave it in the engine bay.

[Legacy777]

Putting it into the intake is a poor choice. Just put a tiny filter on the end and leave it in the engine bay.

Why is putting it into the intake a poor choice? Every single newer car is setup this way without any issues.

[Alphius]

Exactly 0 new cars have the tank vent run directly into the intake. That will do two things, draw flammable vapor into the intake tract which is not a great thing, and put a vacuum on the tank which is a very bad thing.

If it goes into the intake it needs to have a charcoal canister and ECU-controlled purge solenoid. If it doesn't have that setup it needs to be open to atmosphere. Or you can plug the vent tube and find an old-school vented gas cap.

[robertpaige]

I'll find a small filter. Which hard line is the tank vent out?

[Legacy777]

Exactly 0 new cars have the tank vent run directly into the intake. That will do two things, draw flammable vapor into the intake tract which is not a great thing, and put a vacuum on the tank which is a very bad thing.

If it goes into the intake it needs to have a charcoal canister and ECU-controlled purge solenoid. If it doesn't have that setup it needs to be open to atmosphere. Or you can plug the vent tube and find an old-school vented gas cap.

Ok....maybe I should have clarified that the charcoal canister & purge solenoid was in there. I am under the impression that Kimo is leaving the purge solenoid. Is this not correct?

If it's not....I'd just plug the line.

[kimokalihi]

Oh, yeah. I'm not messing with the purge solenoid.

[Alphius]

You cannot run the vent line to the purge solenoid directly without a charcoal canister. That would have the same effect as plugging the line, leading to tank vacuum or pressure issues.

Either leave the whole system including charcoal canister alone, or vent the line to atmosphere. Do not just plug the vent line. Your car will not like you.

[beatersubi]

Would vacuum be introduced to the tank if the line was run pre-turbo? Also, why exactly is introducing a potentially flammable vapor into an internal combustion engine a bad thing?

[cj91legss]

I would think the gases would ruin the quality of the air thus making the combustion weaker.

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[James614]

Aside from that, the fuel tank vent is not metered by the MAF. So wouldn't you essentially be introducing a vacuum leak by running it straight to the intake with no purge solenoid?

[sqc151]

after reading up ur guys posts. i had the 1st nipple on the left plugged on the canister. car ran fine, sometimes the gas cap would have pressure. sometimes not.... I now have it vented and saw no change in anything. will update if things change at the gas cap.