One of four rotors is rusty

jmaziarz · Post by **jmaziarz** » Thu Sep 08, 2005 7:03 am

So I finally got around to replacing my old stock 15" wheels with a set of 02' WRX 16" wheels. One by one, I took the old wheels off and put the new ones on. When taking the last (LR) wheel off I noticed that the rotor was pretty rusted, not shiny like the other three. Could it be a caliper sticking? I drive this car about 110 miles/day so I am a little worried. Anyone have any ideas as to how I can diagnose this problem?

Thanks,
-Jer

entirelyturbo · Post by **entirelyturbo** » Thu Sep 08, 2005 7:49 am

Rusted where?

professor · Post by **professor** » Thu Sep 08, 2005 4:27 pm

I think you have diagnosed the problem... if its rusty on the wiped area, check the back side and see if its shiny

you may have a disintegrated pad but more likely your caliper slider pins are jammed up and all your braking force is going to the inside of the rotor

or the piston is seized in the caliper and your not getting any braking at that corner really (not good at all)

personally I'd trash the caliper and bracket and replace with a good used one with freshly cleaned and greased slider pins, turn both rear rotors (or replace if bad) and new pads

its not worth fooling with when you can get a good caliper for probably $25. usually unless you replace the slider pins they get stuck again because they get scored up when stuck, easier to trash the whole lot, and safer, too

jmaziarz · Post by **jmaziarz** » Thu Sep 08, 2005 4:37 pm

professor wrote: its not worth fooling with when you can get a good caliper for probably $25. usually unless you replace the slider pins they get stuck again because they get scored up when stuck, easier to trash the whole lot, and safer, too

Thanks for the advise. I am fairly new at auto repair as you can probably tell. Where do you get replacement calipers for $25? I was looking at prices over on 1stsubaruparts.com and found replacement calipers for $296.

Over at 1stsubaruparts.com they have "Caliper overhaul kits" for $18.50. What is that and is it something I could use? Again, pardon my ignorance.

gt2.5turbo · Post by **gt2.5turbo** » Thu Sep 08, 2005 6:10 pm

i think he ment you could get a good set of used calipers of $25

scottzg · Post by **scottzg** » Thu Sep 08, 2005 6:29 pm

I'll sell you one for 15 incl shipping.

jmaziarz · Post by **jmaziarz** » Thu Sep 08, 2005 6:48 pm

scottzg wrote:I'll sell you one for 15 incl shipping.

Sounds good to me. I assume that it is in good condition. Do you have more than one? Should I be replacing the rear caliper(s) as a pair or is just one alright?

Please PM me with details including payment info (PayPal?).

jmaziarz · Post by **jmaziarz** » Thu Sep 15, 2005 1:05 am

I took apart both rear break assemblies this afternoon and compared the working one with the non-working (rusty rotor) one. Here is what I found:

DR - problem side

1. Outboard side of rotor is rusty as mentioned above
2. Inboard side of rotor is shiny (making contact w/pad)
3. Outboard pad is almost new (a lot of meat on it)
4. Inboard pad has about 3/8 meat left on it
5. Pads are impossible to get out of bracket without a hammer
6. Caliper moves freely on pins after compressing piston slightly

PR - working side (for comparison)

1. Outboard side of rotor is shiny (making contact w/pad)
2. Inboard side of rotor is shiny (making contact w/pad)
3. Outboard pad has about 1/2 meat left on it
4. Inboard pad has about 1/2 meat left on it
5. Pads are movable in the brackets
6. Caliper moves freely on pins after compressing piston slightly

After comparing the two, the only real difference I see is point #5. I would suspect that the pads being completely stuck in the brackets is not a good thing. I talked to a friend who mentioned I should replace both sets of pads. I think that is what I am going to do unless someone has a better idea of what might be wrong.

What is a typical (non-performance of course) suggestion for a replacement pad?

scottzg · Post by **scottzg** » Thu Sep 15, 2005 1:08 am

ooh, rear calipers... not sure i have any of them. I'll have to go check.

Looks like you dont need them anyway.

The extra expense of a 'performance' pad is well worth it. A light performance pad really has no downside.

jmaziarz · Post by **jmaziarz** » Thu Sep 15, 2005 1:12 am

scottzg: If you have a rear caliper that you would be willing to sell I may still be interested (if replacing the pads doesn't actually fix things).

professor · Post by **professor** » Thu Sep 15, 2005 2:06 pm

sometimes you do see uneven wear from inside to outside pad, but in your case it is too much, and the rusty rotor means something is wrong

even though the caliper seems to slide freely on the pins, there is likely wear on the pins, so that when the caliper applies force, the worn pins lock up

this is pretty common

just replacing pads will not help your situation, just prolong it

you need to replace the slider pins or the whole caliper, turn the rotors, new pads, bed the pads. lube the pins on the other side while you are at it

mikec · Post by **mikec** » Thu Sep 15, 2005 3:12 pm

I would think its the problem you noticed with the pad not moving in the bracket, not the sliders.

Can't for the life of me remember what the older Legacys look like, but if they're the same as newer Subarus (its been a while since I've had my brakes apart), check to see if the metal clip is compressed, and grabbing the pad too tight. Also, clean up the mating surfaces and lube them.

Also, you might have to remove any paint on the pad where it meets the bracket.

Busdriver · Post by **Busdriver** » Thu Sep 15, 2005 6:37 pm

My RR pads were worn quite less than my LR, what is that caliper overhaul kit?
new guide pin and rubber boot?
my rubber boot was torn...
I think this should help me out, eh?

skid542 · Post by **skid542** » Thu Sep 15, 2005 7:10 pm

Most rebuild kits come with guide pin, rubber boots, and some grease. I rebuilt the front calipers on my last car and it made a difference. If your boot was torn then I'd do a good visual check for surface rust or anything when you rebuild it. If you find some, remove with polishing paper.

I also have my old rear brakes, rotors, calipers, and a set of unused pads. If you decide to replace and can't find anything elsewhere, shoot me a PM.

Busdriver · Post by **Busdriver** » Thu Sep 15, 2005 7:38 pm

Lee if that is meant for me, I appreciate it, I think all I need is a kit, but you never now, eh?!

skid542 · Post by **skid542** » Thu Sep 15, 2005 9:58 pm

No problem, I've been keeping them around for when someone else might need them, let me know if anything changes.

Busdriver · Post by **Busdriver** » Thu Sep 15, 2005 10:07 pm

Sweet, Thanks!!

jmaziarz · Post by **jmaziarz** » Mon Oct 31, 2005 6:01 pm

So I finally found the time to work on the car last week. Here is my progress. Note that the problem is not completely solved yet.

1. Blackbart kindly shipped me a caliper
2. Purchased a new set of rear rotors/pads

http://bbs.legacycentral.org/viewtopic. ... 987#138987

3. Purchased a new locking pin, guide pin and sealing washer from my local Subaru dealer
4. Installed new rotors/pads and caliper w/pins + sealing washer
5. Blead breaks
6. Followed procedure for properly bedding the new pads
7. Drove to work and back the following day (107 miles)

The result? While the rotors are obviously not as rusty as they were I am still seeing the same problem. The LR outer pad is only making about 50% contact with the rotor. For reference, the RR outer pad is making full contact as the entire surface of the rotor is starting to show wear. At this point, the only parts that were not replaced were the mounting bracket that the pads sit in and the clips. I did follow the suggestion mentioned earlier of knocking off the painted surfaces on the new pads but in all the pads were _very_ tight in the bracket. So much so that it was near impossible to move them once I finally got them in.

I am trying to drive the car (and break) as little as possible until I can get a replacement bracket and clips. Even after spending $125 on new rotors/pads and a caliper w/parts I think I am still doing pretty good on savings factor. For someone like me, the experience in doing this myself is priceless. And I thank everyone for their helpful advise and direction.

Does anyone have a bracket + clips that are in working order? How much?

Thanks,
-Jeremy

jmaziarz · Post by **jmaziarz** » Mon Oct 31, 2005 6:02 pm

If I have some time tonight or tomorrow, I'll post some pictures of the problem as I am seeing it.

BAC5.2 · Post by **BAC5.2** » Tue Nov 01, 2005 5:14 am

How does your right front brake look?

jmaziarz · Post by **jmaziarz** » Tue Nov 01, 2005 5:59 am

BAC5.2 wrote:How does your right front brake look?

Looks fine as far as I can tell. I have not had a problem with my front brakes (as far as I know) but I am all for suggestions. What might I be looking for in my right-front brake that could point to a problem with the left-rear? Also, when you say "brake" are you refering to the entire assembly including the caliper and pads?

Thanks,
-Jer

BAC5.2 · Post by **BAC5.2** » Tue Nov 01, 2005 3:31 pm

Well a sign of brake system failure would be the opposite corner acting similarly. It could lead to an internal leak somewhere in the system or something else, maybe an ABS solenoid is stuck.

jmaziarz · Post by **jmaziarz** » Tue Nov 01, 2005 9:56 pm

Interesting, I'll have to keep that in mind. No ABS on my Subie.

professor · Post by **professor** » Wed Nov 02, 2005 2:00 am

don't panic, I just replaced my rear brakes and you can barely see any wear marks on them after 200 miles

is there rust on your new rotors already ?

jmaziarz · Post by **jmaziarz** » Wed Nov 02, 2005 6:31 am

I would not be worried except for the fact that the wear is exactly the same as it was initially. I am afraid that the new rotors, pads, caliper with new pins is not the solution or fix I was hoping for.

I'll take pictures to clarify.

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One of four rotors is rusty

One of four rotors is rusty