Chevy Cobalt *rant*

evolutionmovement · Post by **evolutionmovement** » Sat Sep 09, 2006 9:13 pm

Got rear ended by a woman (of course) in a new Audi just 2 whole weeks out of the body shop for a parking lot hit and run. Had to get a rental. Chevy Cobalt.

This car sucks balls.

I read a comparo between the Chevy Cobalt (Cavalier - who are they trying to kid?) and the Mazda 3 for the hell of it and remembered why I don't read domestic publications. Were I the author, I would've written a page about the Mazda and then smeared my morning shit on the page for the Chevy part. It's the shining example of why the domestics are failing. Even Chevy knows it - the owner's manual is written for retards, who are probably the only ones who'd ever buy one besides a rental place and then only ''cause we always buy Chevy'. Instead they actually tried to put the Chevy just under the Mazda and put the difference up to luxury (cough* laugh*) versus sport. No wonder I've yet to see a Cobalt SS. Who'd buy a $25k car with a $10k interior? I'd rather get a Hyundai for the better warranty. My Mazda with low profiles even rides nicer (without rattling and shaking) than the high sidewall steels the Chevy runs on.

The Chevy does have a really good turning circle... Um, yeah. Oh, yeah and an accessory outlet (unlike the damn Mazda - get with the times!) so I don't have to choose between phone charger and ipod (no choice really - people better not just talk too much if the phone's low on charge). OK, I'm done with positives.

I should've gone through my insurance and gotten the upgrade but figured it wasn't worth the PITA factor. Now the PITA is the one I get from the uncomfortable (yet still relatively soft) seat.

Are there crickets living in it? No, it's squeaking from several places with less than 20k miles. Oh, but it's a rental and has had a hard life maybe. Mm, with such a wallowy suspension there's no excuse as well as my beat up Legacy not squeaking until around 200k. That's 2 zeros GM.

Subaru built a much better car in 1983 at least as that's the earliest one I've owned.

I'm very angry that GM puts out this shit and their execs make 6 and 7 figures while the company tanks. And it's the little guys who'll be out of work while those incompetant pricks move on to another job they pretend to work at and make big money. And they can bitch all they want about the UAW or government regulations, price of gas they should've seen coming, baboons farting in the Detroit Zoo or whatever - this car doesn't suck because of a lack of money as much as a lack of interest. The design and engineering is a joke. Hell, I'd even rather get a VW!

no1subarufan · Post by **no1subarufan** » Sat Sep 09, 2006 9:43 pm

evolutionmovement wrote:Hell, I'd even rather get a VW!

Whats wrong with VW? My mom has a 2000 Passat GLX 4motion (AWD) V6 and I love it. 75000 miles and no problems yet. Looks good, rides nice and is kinda fast (top end speed).

Imprezive · Post by **Imprezive** » Sun Sep 10, 2006 1:10 am

vee-dubs always seem to just fall apart electronicaly. (atleast the ones I have seen). I agree that GM = LAMEASS

I've never ridden in a cobalt but from what people have said about them I hope I never do!

Manarius · Post by **Manarius** » Sun Sep 10, 2006 2:09 am

My friend has an 06 Cobalt sedan. I laughed at how cheap the interior felt. And, I even think that my 153k mile car could outrun her 8k mile Cobalt.

entirelyturbo · Post by **entirelyturbo** » Sun Sep 10, 2006 3:29 am

Steve, out of curiosity, is your Legacy FHI or SOA?

As I've kept saying, Americans don't build cars with any care or passion, neither for performance or quality. They build them to get their Friday paycheck and drink it all away before Sunday. And it shows.

My dealer traded my 05 Mazda B3000 for a leftover 06 Mazda B3000. Same POS, only newer. It had 15 miles on it when I drove it the first time. And STILL, I hear the exact same clunk in the front when turning slowly over a slight bump, the transmission dogs the engine the same way, and I can still see the guts of the ignition switch in between the key cover thingie and the column cover.

Of course, this is Ford we're talking about, who still make the shittiest cars IMO.

Steve, did you find that the Cobalt's steering is the most vague, cheap, and disconnected of any car you've ever driven? That's how I felt when I drove one.

I'm not going to go into my experience with a Cobalt, for my own legal protection. Let's just say it was a rental car

free5ty1e · Post by **free5ty1e** » Sun Sep 10, 2006 3:35 am

I think the Cobalt is kinda like those movies that never really made it into the theater and went straight to DVD or VHS... it's like... "Cobalt... made directly for abuse as a rental car. Not intended for actual ownership."

On that note, POS FWD rental cars are fun with the insurance option. Can I use the handbrake on every turn, and run without an air filter? ...'cause I'm gonna. (they love hearing that)

magicmike · Post by **magicmike** » Sun Sep 10, 2006 6:51 am

well the main reason for me not being so prominant on the board lately is because I am working on a project in the belly of the beaste. Yes my company sold some grinding machines to GM and I'm the poor shlep who is responsible for getting all 8 machines accepted and collecting our remaining 10% of the order. I can tell you from being inside for almost 2 years now that the UAW is the main cause of the problems. These fucking lazy never worked a fucking day in their life useless motherfuckers over there are the reason for a cobalt costing 20k. After working there for a few years I can honestly say that I do not know how GM is able to produce a single automobile. The UAW is in contract with GM for all the maintanance of all the machinary on the shop floor. so if there is something wrong with one of my machines that they havent fully paid for and dont fully own they make me fly out there to find out what the problem is and then I have to sit there while their (get ready for the oxymoron of the century here) "skilled trades" people argue with each other over who will do what on the machine. heres an example. There is a prox switch that has failed on a nuematic gripper. I would have a new prox in in about 5 minutes tops. These fuckers would do the following:

1. I have to call them in the first place. This involves pressing a call button on the machine HMI. This then puts me (the machine) in a buffer on their maximo system as next in line for that given trade. when the next person is available they get a text message on their nextel and they show up. This can take anywhere from a 1/2 hour to 4 to 6 hours sometimes they dont show up at all.
2. They show up and start locking out the machine for safety, even after I instruct them that the machine is in a de-energized state whenever the safety doors are open. The killer here is that they are working on replacing a 24volt prox and they kill the 480 volt main power and leave the 120 volt power on because its inside the panel and they are too stupid to read the lockout placard correctly.
3. ok so we have an electrician and the machine is locked out. I tell them which switch is bad and they want to know how i know the switch is bad. I have to tell them that I've already debugged the problem and all I need from them is a switch. This is never good enough. meanwhile I have the plant productiuon manager screaming at me to get the machine up and running but I'm not allowed to touch the machine.
4. so, after having to explain to a 6th grade drop out how a prox switch works and what the little lights anbd colors mean on them we can get to removing the stupid thing right? wrong. you see the switch is mounbted on a neumatic cylinder. he automatically says that he cant touch neumatics and we need a pipe fitter to remove the hoses.
5. press call button for a pipe fitter and go back to number 1 on this list. ok when you get back to this point point again this time with the 5th grade drop-out stupid fuck making 150k a year you can finally take the switch out.
6. ok now we have the switch out and we have the model number. wheres the new switch? we have to enter the order into the "system" and wait for an offsite company called setech to literally drive a switch over from the 30 minute away warehouse where the spareparts are kept.
7. so the switch arrives and sits on the dock for about 3 hours because no one knows that we need the switch.
8. we get the switch and the electrician installs it on the cylinder and the pipe fitter connects the lines.
9. so heres the kicker. these guys are now done and they walk away INTENTINALLY not pressing the cancel button on the call screen so that the "system" doesn't know that they are finished and they wont get another call until someone finds out that the call was never canceled.
10. final result. the machine is down for 2 days for a simple prox switch and it costs my company around 3k to send me there to "supervise"

There was one guy who did not work for a month because his nextel was not getting calls. he came in and read a book for 12 hour shifts 7 days a week for almost a month, making double time on sundays. when confronted he said " its not my problem the system doesn't work"

This is why GM is hurting. its the fucking leeches working for the UAW that are greedy beyond belief. These are people who have worked in a factory their whole life. They do not know what its like to have to work for a living and what its like to have to earn your possition, and earn raises, and earn promotions. I have never had so much hatred in my life as I do for labor unions. I swear they will lead to the death of the american economy.

ok my rant is over.

wiscon_mark · Post by **wiscon_mark** » Sun Sep 10, 2006 7:39 am

I've heard good stuff about the cobalt SS, but I'm guessing the standard cobalt is teh suck.

0perose · Post by **0perose** » Sun Sep 10, 2006 2:37 pm

I had a cobalt rental car in colorado..

yeeeeeeeeaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaahhhh

I'm keeping my mouth shut too

greg donovan · Post by **greg donovan** » Sun Sep 10, 2006 3:54 pm

magicmike wrote:well the main reason for me not being so prominant on the board lately is because I am working on a project in the belly of the beaste. Yes my company sold some grinding machines to GM and I'm the poor shlep who is responsible for getting all 8 machines accepted and collecting our remaining 10% of the order. I can tell you from being inside for almost 2 years now that the UAW is the main cause of the problems. These fucking lazy never worked a fucking day in their life useless motherfuckers over there are the reason for a cobalt costing 20k. After working there for a few years I can honestly say that I do not know how GM is able to produce a single automobile. The UAW is in contract with GM for all the maintanance of all the machinary on the shop floor. so if there is something wrong with one of my machines that they havent fully paid for and dont fully own they make me fly out there to find out what the problem is and then I have to sit there while their (get ready for the oxymoron of the century here) "skilled trades" people argue with each other over who will do what on the machine. heres an example. There is a prox switch that has failed on a nuematic gripper. I would have a new prox in in about 5 minutes tops. These fuckers would do the following:

1. I have to call them in the first place. This involves pressing a call button on the machine HMI. This then puts me (the machine) in a buffer on their maximo system as next in line for that given trade. when the next person is available they get a text message on their nextel and they show up. This can take anywhere from a 1/2 hour to 4 to 6 hours sometimes they dont show up at all.
2. They show up and start locking out the machine for safety, even after I instruct them that the machine is in a de-energized state whenever the safety doors are open. The killer here is that they are working on replacing a 24volt prox and they kill the 480 volt main power and leave the 120 volt power on because its inside the panel and they are too stupid to read the lockout placard correctly.
3. ok so we have an electrician and the machine is locked out. I tell them which switch is bad and they want to know how i know the switch is bad. I have to tell them that I've already debugged the problem and all I need from them is a switch. This is never good enough. meanwhile I have the plant productiuon manager screaming at me to get the machine up and running but I'm not allowed to touch the machine.
4. so, after having to explain to a 6th grade drop out how a prox switch works and what the little lights anbd colors mean on them we can get to removing the stupid thing right? wrong. you see the switch is mounbted on a neumatic cylinder. he automatically says that he cant touch neumatics and we need a pipe fitter to remove the hoses.
5. press call button for a pipe fitter and go back to number 1 on this list. ok when you get back to this point point again this time with the 5th grade drop-out stupid fuck making 150k a year you can finally take the switch out.
6. ok now we have the switch out and we have the model number. wheres the new switch? we have to enter the order into the "system" and wait for an offsite company called setech to literally drive a switch over from the 30 minute away warehouse where the spareparts are kept.
7. so the switch arrives and sits on the dock for about 3 hours because no one knows that we need the switch.
8. we get the switch and the electrician installs it on the cylinder and the pipe fitter connects the lines.
9. so heres the kicker. these guys are now done and they walk away INTENTINALLY not pressing the cancel button on the call screen so that the "system" doesn't know that they are finished and they wont get another call until someone finds out that the call was never canceled.
10. final result. the machine is down for 2 days for a simple prox switch and it costs my company around 3k to send me there to "supervise"

There was one guy who did not work for a month because his nextel was not getting calls. he came in and read a book for 12 hour shifts 7 days a week for almost a month, making double time on sundays. when confronted he said " its not my problem the system doesn't work"

This is why GM is hurting. its the fucking leeches working for the UAW that are greedy beyond belief. These are people who have worked in a factory their whole life. They do not know what its like to have to work for a living and what its like to have to earn your possition, and earn raises, and earn promotions. I have never had so much hatred in my life as I do for labor unions. I swear they will lead to the death of the american economy.

ok my rant is over.

for every good thing a labor union has accomplished (and that aint sayin' much) there are just as many problems caused by them. and they all stem around from the crap that you talked about with them not being allowed to do other types of jobs.

on the opposite end of the spectrum one of my Poli. Sci. professors tells about how a airconditioner unit arrived on a job site and all the different unions fought about who would get to intall the thing and it sat around for the whole day while they argued. was it electrical? it was wired in to the building wasnt it? was it ventillation? it uses the air ducts.

evolutionmovement · Post by **evolutionmovement** » Sun Sep 10, 2006 6:24 pm

Mike, my Legacy's FHI. I've felt worse steering than the Cobalt, but they've all been trucks or old boat-cars.

I have no love for unions, especially the overpaid UAW, my concern is more for suppliers and low end sallaried employees, but my problems with this car are beyond its exorbitant price (for what you get) - it's the design and engineering which isn't union. I'm actually somewhat excusing the cheaper materials and spec (drum brakes?!) to allow for the UAW factor. The problem is that they make it for idiots and they know it. Just read the owner's manual - it's condescending and cynical towards the customer, though whoever'd buy one likely wouldn't notice. And that's the point. The retard demographic will only buy out of loyalty so long. Eventually they will move away,hich is slowly happening. GM shows no signs of changing this either and lots of people will be out of work and the economy will take a hell of a hit in turn because of it while the robber-barron criminals in charge move on to spread their virus of incompetance to the insulated halls of yet another large organization.

It costs as much to design an ugly car as an attractive one and you might as well make it look good if it's got nothing else. Look at the Camry - never sold on looks because it has the (usually) bullet-proof reliability your average person wants, but now they actually made them decently attractive and they can't keep them on the lots. This is a car projected to sell hundreds of thousands a year before the first arrive at dealers to begin with. And that in a marketplace that's not all that interested in regular four door sedans compared to the past. This is why Toyota could buy Ford in CASH at current market evaluation and be hardly taking a risk.

Take the PT Cruiser on the other hand - a total piece of shit, but the style appealed to hundreds of thousands who just had to have it for that reason. I was amazed to see they still shift a lot of those things. Who's still buying them? Anyway, at least they were smart enough to try to sell on style when they realized they had nothing else. The Cobalt has nothing. For the record, I think the PT Cruiser is ugly, but the point is it's a subjective love-it-or-hate-it deal. The people that find it ugly will go elsewhere, but those that love it have to have it over the boring-looking competition no matter what and that's a good chunk of guaranteed sales for a substandard car. People buys cars as a reflection of themselves and the PT Cruiser appeals to those who think that kind of thing makes them cool or hip. They may be wrong, but they don't know it and they're happy because of it and when you make payments every month on the lump of depreciating shit in the driveway, don't you want to be happy about it? Why can't these assholes figure that out? They just don't care as long as they can throw that $200k sweet-16 party for their daughter they just don't fucking care. Why doesn't anyone want to shoot these useless fucks? Their thieves and criminals unchecked by a corrupt system and I have to say I respect traditional criminals more for having the balls to do it against a system that will make them pay for their actions if their ever caught.

I feel this car is an insult to the general public (who probably deserve it, but that doesn't help social evolution at all) and I'm disgusted that it continues while the rich cocksuckers in charge get to bitch about it being everything else's fault. I guess, in the end, these execs embody the lack of personal resposibility and greed at any cost attitude that's the ugly side of capitalism which makes my fantasy of a responsible economic society free from the control of corrupt and stagnating governments impossible.

free5ty1e · Post by **free5ty1e** » Sun Sep 10, 2006 7:43 pm

^^^ ...werd, mahbrudda... werd.

apreach on.

Manarius · Post by **Manarius** » Sun Sep 10, 2006 7:47 pm

It's just been part of the trend over the past 20-25 years. The Japanese consistently put out better designed, longer lasting, and more advanced cars than the Americans. Add to that, they produce them at lower prices! (And some of those cars are built in America!). GM and Ford's unwillingness to catch up with the times is what keeps them from getting back their share of the marketplace.

BTW, my car is from SIA, and it has been to hell and back and has only needed Wheel Bearings and axles.

entirelyturbo · Post by **entirelyturbo** » Sun Sep 10, 2006 7:47 pm

evolutionmovement wrote:Mike, my Legacy's FHI.

As I figured. No wonder you didn't have some of the problems I've had.

evolutionmovement wrote:I've felt worse steering than the Cobalt, but they've all been trucks or old boat-cars.

Interesting, as the one thing I can give the Fords I've driven is decent steering. My B3000's is pretty intuitive, and although the Econoline I drove at Toyota wasn't exactly sporting, it turned the wheels enough to make it far more maneuverable than one would expect from a van. Those are steering boxes too, which is sad.

The main issue with a union is that it allows people to be paid more money without asking for any increase in work ethic. This, in my opinion, is causing the downfall of the Big Three. Thanks to these unions, they have to shell out more money to these greedy lazy motherfuckers who produce poorer quality work. So, after the buying public gets tired of their Fords catching on fire, their Chryslers blowing up transmissions, and their GMs interior pieces falling apart, they go to a company that has its cars built by people who care about building cars in the interest of quality, and those people are in Europe (well, some of them anyway) and Japan.

I asked where Steve's Legacy was built for this very same reason. His Legacy was built in Japan, and look at all the abuse he's put it through, and it's still running (I think, isn't it Steve? It can run at least?). My Legacy was built in Indiana, and I've done my fair share to it, don't get me wrong, but I haven't abused it like Steve abused his, and look at all the bullshit I've had to go through, even the stuff that I didn't cause. The same thing goes for the 93 wagon my grandfather and I had. It was also built in Indiana, and that car was a nightmare.

Oh, well. At least I can still buy a hamburger for less than $10, not many countries can say that.

jnorion · Post by **jnorion** » Mon Sep 11, 2006 1:52 am

I think in general the design/engineering of the car is more to blame than the workers who put it together. American (and GM in particular) cars have ALWAYS felt cheap inside... my 91 Subaru feels less like toy plastic than most brand new American cars. And they've never really cared about features... someone mentioned drum brakes, of course they have shitty equipment.

wiscon_mark · Post by **wiscon_mark** » Mon Sep 11, 2006 1:56 am

The thing that really ticks me off, is how Subarus (older Subarus anyways) got poor reviews on the interior, because it was "spartan" and simple.

WTF is wrong with that? Simplicity, and very intuitive design makes it easier to drive. Materials & build (excepting the cupholders maybe) are all pretty decent, and everything works, even if the lighting can be a bit buggy.

evolutionmovement · Post by **evolutionmovement** » Mon Sep 11, 2006 4:47 am

Car magazines are as biased as the FIA officials. They suck. They actually tried to compare the Chevy's interior to the Mazda 3 and called it bright compared to the Mazda's dark dungeon. The build quality and materials, aside from the design are in different classes entirely and how could they not shit on a car that has plastic wood?

As for Subarus, I've always felt the've been shit on unfairly. I mean, I've been in several E46 BMWs and felt their interior was hardly better than my 1990 Legacys. The materials seemed a little more durable, but the fit was no better at all and my Subaru's held up very well which is a testament to its durability. yet, they raved about the BMW when it was out. You hardly even heard about the nightmares VW put on the road. They lick the balls of anything German, try to protect the domestics as if they were the picked-on retard in the school yard, and treat Subaru like the ugly girl at the prom.

Richard · Post by **Richard** » Mon Sep 11, 2006 7:41 am

Not to mentoin that GM has to pay people not to work. They have a pool of employees ready to take positions of other people. And we're not talking 10 or 20 people. We're talking hundreds, possibly thousands of people who sit at home and collect a full paycheck for absolutely no work.

I like trade unions more than general labor unions. The masons we had doing work at our new building showed up on time, if not earlier. They had all their tools and were ready to work at 7AM. They busted ass until they took a break, which they rigidly timed, and went right back to busting ass. These guys earned their 25 to 35 bucks an hour and were quite proud of thier work.

I don't know how some of these UAW pricks sleep at night.

snowboarded · Post by **snowboarded** » Mon Sep 11, 2006 2:27 pm

evolutionmovement wrote:Car magazines are as biased as the FIA officials. They suck. They actually tried to compare the Chevy's interior to the Mazda 3 and called it bright compared to the Mazda's dark dungeon. The build quality and materials, aside from the design are in different classes entirely and how could they not shit on a car that has plastic wood?

As for Subarus, I've always felt the've been shit on unfairly. I mean, I've been in several E46 BMWs and felt their interior was hardly better than my 1990 Legacys. The materials seemed a little more durable, but the fit was no better at all and my Subaru's held up very well which is a testament to its durability. yet, they raved about the BMW when it was out. You hardly even heard about the nightmares VW put on the road. They lick the balls of anything German, try to protect the domestics as if they were the picked-on retard in the school yard, and treat Subaru like the ugly girl at the prom.

HAHA! Ugly girl at the prom. Well, its always the quiet ones that you have to worry about...

Brat4by4 · Post by **Brat4by4** » Mon Sep 11, 2006 2:46 pm

Snowboarded worked at a GM plant for a short while as tradesman.

I'm pretty sure he said there were guys that were paid to come in and read the paper all day because the union would not let them lay anyone off even if the work was not there.

snowboarded · Post by **snowboarded** » Mon Sep 11, 2006 3:55 pm

I was in the local carpenters union in the Milwright subdivision. Let me tell you that I have nothing but hate for the union. I got out because they couldn't find me work. There is so much bull crap and politics, that anyone who isn't a good ol' boy gets screwed. By the way, they still have $1,700 that belong to me that I can't get ahold of because of some screwy rule they have about total hours of work being spread out over two years. I got laid off in february but worked more than enough hours to qaulify to receive this money form the previous year. UGH!!! So much for engine management or getting out of debt...

Union is bogus for that kind of thing and the UAW is even worse, people there would just sit arround and play cards and read the paper all day. Then every 20 minutes or so, scamper off to move some doors or something and then come back and do it again. By the way the GM plant I was at was in charge of producing the cobalts. how's that for coincidence?

wiscon_mark · Post by **wiscon_mark** » Mon Sep 11, 2006 6:02 pm

A union should protect the workers, not restrict them. Retarted. If you want to work more, consider it overtime or something...

entirelyturbo · Post by **entirelyturbo** » Mon Sep 11, 2006 8:26 pm

As far as the drum brake argument goes, the GG bugeye 2.5TS wagon and Outback Sport had rear drum brakes, and the SG Forester 2.5X has had rear drum brakes from the start.

EVERY company, even Subaru, still cuts corners to save a few bucks.

wiscon_mark · Post by **wiscon_mark** » Mon Sep 11, 2006 9:04 pm

I have 4 wheel disc and wouldn't have it any other way. Our hondas have drum brakes though, and they're not bad, but I like the Subaru's stopping ability a heck of a lot better...

Richard · Post by **Richard** » Tue Sep 12, 2006 12:46 am

Hell yes. Until you go nuts like I just did and spend $650 bucks on badass rotors and pads.

AAARRRRRRGHHH (Howard Dean scream)

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