legacycentral bbs

Well lets put this simple.

My auto has died in my 1993 SS...

Was giving it the beans in 2nd gear to 3rd gear and....SLIP city!

It will not hold RPM over 2500rpms now....

So

I dont care that the AT is dead really, im going to do a trans swap!

So here is what i have been looking at:


6mt out of a 2011 STi $3500obo 11kms
Thats just for swap bits. Still need other parts...


5mt out of a 2000/01 Impreza RS $600 200kms
Thats everything to do a swap other than a D shaft? I dont know what will fit really with what diff and trans combo.

5mt out of a 1999 legacy wagon base $500 260kms
COMPLETE CAR!!!!! Had a T belt let go. Not a big issue cuz its the LAST 2.2 with phase 1 heads on it!


So ya.

My real concern is the D shaft? What will work with a 1993 SS that was a AT?

Also side NOTE:

Yes the know the FD of the cars! I have all the service manuals for every Subaru basically!!!

The 5mts will have new gears slapped in from Rally spec...maybe them not to sure about gears inside the 5mt really? Like companies really

http://www.rallispec.com/prod_trans.htm

Thoughts?


Thanks


Tom

the 6mt uses your auto driveshaft. The 5mt needs a 90-94 Legacy manual driveshaft. Wagon or sedan, same thing.

I believe the 04-05 STI had 3.9 final drive so you just use your rear diff and driveshaft. The current body style STI uses a different type (read: incompatible) speed sensor setup. So basically you need to get one from 04-07.

The RS tranny isn't a good deal at all with 200k km on it. Unless it comes with everything you need such as: legacy 5mt driveline, hydraulic pedal set, clutch kit, rear diff in 4.11 FD, hydraulic master and slave cylinders. Note that you'll need all of that too for the STI tranny (minus the driveline of course)

Hmmm

Never new that stuff about the 11 sti trans!!

Well

Lets say i get the 99 legacy parts car.

Cant i just use EVERYTHING from that car totally into my legacy? Did they actually change the D shaft length?

Of coarse i would change the clutch and pressure plate and maybe the flywheel for a new one.

And yes the RS trans setup does come with everything. Its a parts car but the guy dont want to sell the whole car to me....

- The legacy parts car won't work for the driveline - the lengths are similar but not the same. Josh mentioned using half of the 2nd gen legacy drive shaft with half of yours, and that'll be the correct length (only if you have a 2-piece driveshaft of course)
-the pedals in the 99 legacy will only work if it's a hydraulic tranny, cable clutch pedals won't work with the RS or STI tranny.

There is some info on nasioc about splitting modern (08+ or Legacy Spec B) 6mt's apart and modifying it to work with the older cars. But that adds time and expense.

Mike did a very good job explaining some of the intricacies. Your 93 should have the two piece drive shaft, so you'd just use the front part from the 99 and the rear part from your 93.

Perfect!

Well i think im going to get the 99 legacy if i can.

Here is my plan about this drive train swap:

Get 99 legacy.

Build up the old 99 legacy trans.

Uses EVERYTHING from the 99 legacy into my 93 legacy ss.

And thanks Legacy777 and mike-tracy for the drive shaft info's!

Will totally make 1 drive shaft out of 2.

I have NO idea if the 99 legacy is a hydro tho? I think it does but im not TOOO sure.

Does anyone know of any good trans gears? Like PPG or rally specs? Am i missing any really?

The '99 Legacy will be a PhaseII EJ22 with a cable clutch. Look forward to some bent valves on her, but if you wanted to do a cable clutch 5mt swap it would be a good parts car.

Hmm so its a cable clutch yous say.

So that leads me to this.

I was poking around the web and i really cant find any "upgrade" clutches for a 1999 legacy 2.2?

Also i cant find any new gear sets ANY where for a 1999 legacy 2.2?

I just keep finding impreza and junk.

From what i know all 5mt's are basically the same. So why is this so hard to find junk for a 99 legacy 2.2???

Also side note:

How strong is the cable clutch setup really? Also the trans i guess?

My car is no slouch! My but dyno tells me i run as fast as a wrx with ease! And i will be getting much MUCH more torque when tuned.

So really im buying a beater car for parts and to build a light weight high performance 5mt.

I will be splitting the trans apart and going though it to make sure. AKA building it.

Thoughts???

Tom

HI,
The RS is only 120K miles....but it IS an RS and may have been driven hard...trying to keep up w/ WRX's!

I put a '98 Forester (edit) transmission w/a cable clutch in my '90 when I swapped it - I just used the cable clutch fork and mounting point on the trans. I used an '06 WRX ACT Streetlite FW, and heavy duty PP and clutch disc. Worked fined and wasn't noticeably harder to engage then a friend's hydraulic clutch in his SS.

The Subarus have the Pull vs. Push style to deal with. I know the SS was a Pull as well as the US WRX from '02-'05. I 'think' all the NA Subies from '90+ were Push - whether they were Hydraulic or Cable. (BTW, the Push style TO bearings are MUCH cheaper too.)

Double-check if the pedal box - (clutch/brake ) is the same between both styles.

Watch out for the rear diff's pinion flange that the driveline bolts to. The bolt spacing changed around the '95 model. I used a '93 Legacy driveline and swapped out the pinion flange on the diff. I could have used the front part of the '93 and the rear part of a '95 and it would have bolted up, IIRC.

TD

The pedal boxes are different between the cable and hydro clutch setups.

Bottom line is there is a lot stuff that is "compatible", but you are likely not going to find an easy decoder chart that says this part that is listed for an Impreza works for the Legacy. Subaru has a tendancy to make small changes that no longer allows for some of the cross platform compatibility between parts.

So wtdash you had a 2006 wrx flywheel in a cable clutch setup?

Im going to assume that you used a matching 2006 wrx clutch with it.

Also.

Starter doesnt have any problems with a different 5mt flywheel?

Tommio RS wrote:So wtdash you had a 2006 wrx flywheel in a cable clutch setup?

Im going to assume that you used a matching 2006 wrx clutch with it.

Techncically it was an ACT brand LW FW, PP and disc that was designed to fit an '06-07 WRX transmission, but it also worked fine on my '98 Forester (edit: same as Outback) transmission.
And Yes, it worked fine w/a cable clutch...recommend buying a new cable for the install.

Here are some of the parts I used (the axles behind the trans are for the '00 rear diff, not the front):


The 2 different fork - cable-type on top:


And the pivot ball (?) on the trans you can change to swap between cable and hydraulic types- just unscrew the ball and put in the other location (directly below it in this pic):

Tommio RS wrote:Starter doesnt have any problems with a different 5mt flywheel?

The '98 Subaru starter I used worked fine w/the ACT LW FW.

(Note about the clutch that I learned from others on here - and you probably know......You want the clutch to go (break) b4 the trans, since it's cheaper to fix. So, buying a 'heavy duty' clutch setup may not be the best choice if you're using a non-turbo trans, IMHO. I've seen the OEM/Exedy clutch kits w/FW's on RS25.com and NASIOC for sale - used - for about $120 w/lower miles.)

Td

wtdash!

Thanks a bunch! You single handed answer all my questions!

If i do get the cable clutch trans i will FOR SURE buy a new cable. and a new speedo cable. Mines toast!

The clutch is also much easier than i though!

And it just makes sense to have a new clutch disc installed and machined flywheel or new.

Thanks

Will know this week if i get the 99 donor legacy!

Hmmm well from my digging yet again i have found that in the 1999 legacy model year range. Probably in other also.

The main shafts in the transmissions EG: 2.5L vs 2.2L are different?

If i can find a way to show what i mean i sure will!

Its seems to me that the 2.2L main shaft has less crap on it compared to a 2.5L trans?

Does anyone else understand what i mean?

Im just concerned about what gears i can slap in really.

Thanks

Tom

get the 04-06 6 speed and be done with it lol i have a swt of wrx pedals if u end up needing them, let me know

Someperson. Will let ya know if i need them.

THO!

I have now figured out this trans business!

Any subaru with a 2.2L that is AWD is actually a 2wd trans with the back half of a awd trans.

So that tells me that the 2.2L trans is NOT as tough as a 2.5L trans

So back on the hunt for a 6mt or a 5mt....

Any one know of a good deal on a 6mt????

nasioc or ebay

Tommio RS wrote:Any subaru with a 2.2L that is AWD is actually a 2wd trans with the back half of a awd trans.

So that tells me that the 2.2L trans is NOT as tough as a 2.5L trans

So how do you figure that?

The 5spd design is exactly the same between the 2.2 and 2.5 trans.

All the 5spd transmissions are the same. The AWD has a transfer case and extension case bolted onto the rear where the FWD just has a rear case. The drive pinion shaft is different obviously, but as mentioned, there is no substantial difference. In all actuallity the FWD trans will likely hold up to more power since the case is more compact (stiffer), and doesn't have as much load exerting on the gears since the front tires will more easily lose traction compared to an AWD car.

Here are some blow ups of both the FWD and AWD 5spd transmissions.

FWD:
http://main.experiencetherave.com/subar ... iption.jpg

AWD:
http://main.experiencetherave.com/subar ... iption.jpg

Well they probably are very very similar but they are by no means the same.

The main shaft on a 2.2L 5mt does not have the same number of parts on it compared to the 2.5L 5mt.

That is why im ruling 2.2L 5mt as "not" as strong as the 2.5L 5mt.


2.2L 5mt MAIN SHAFT


2.5L 5mt MAIN SHAFT


The crappy pic were pulled for the OEM manuals.

If i could just give you the OEM manual i would....But i cant soo you will have to live with sideways pics.

Tommio RS wrote:Well they probably are very very similar but they are by no means the same.

The main shaft on a 2.2L 5mt does not have the same number of parts on it compared to the 2.5L 5mt.

That is why im ruling 2.2L 5mt as "not" as strong as the 2.5L 5mt.

The number of parts does not really have any bearing on whether it is stronger or not. The additional parts on the 2.5 transmission in the diagram you posted are related to the reverse gear synchro, that is all.

Hmmm. You know i never though about the reverse synchro!

Dam....know i feel just a wee bit retarded....

So ya...In the end it sort of does not matter really.

If you have any 5mt and you want to do anything to it, you just need to so some research to what fits where.

Thank you Legacy777!!

Tom