Hi,
I'm pretty new to the subaru engine world and have got some silly questions which I need answered. As a little background info, I have just brought a 1989 Legacy RS with a EJ20G (i think?) and upgraded to this from a 1982 Leone Turbo.
What do these terms mean?
* Closed deck
* Swing arm HLA DOHC heads
* Shortblock
What is better and why?
Which of this things do I have?
Thankx for your help!
Hayden
silly questions
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kingbobdole
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I'll be nice and promote your super lazyness
* Closed deck
May want to search for pix of this. Closed deck means that the engine has more of a coolant passage setup where as the open deck has a "coolant sleeve" that goes right around the outside of the cylinders. open deck is usually found in newer Rus... and hondas and lots of others. Its cheaper to build since theres less metal, the engine gets to temp faster and stays cool easier. The open deck has issues with big boost since the cylinder walls are so thing, it tends to warp the cylinders resulting in Head gasket failure. Closed deck can have cooling issues but doesnt have cylinder warpage issues under big boost.
* Swing arm HLA DOHC heads
This is a description of a cylinder head... its bolted to the block, where the valves and spark plugs and such are. Swing arm is the little...arm that the HLA( Hydraulic lash adjuster(hydraulic lifter)) DOHC is Dual over head cam... 2 cams run the valves. They are "over the head" as opposed to either OHV (over head valve) where the cam is found in the block, or flat head where the cam and valves are found in the block.
* Shortblock
Its the block.... Long block usually donates a "complete engine" minus accessories like the alt, compressor and such, but the long block has heads, cams, pistons, block, and sometimes mainfolds. Short block is the low end... the block, pistons, and crank... not much else, usually in one piece.
* Closed deck
May want to search for pix of this. Closed deck means that the engine has more of a coolant passage setup where as the open deck has a "coolant sleeve" that goes right around the outside of the cylinders. open deck is usually found in newer Rus... and hondas and lots of others. Its cheaper to build since theres less metal, the engine gets to temp faster and stays cool easier. The open deck has issues with big boost since the cylinder walls are so thing, it tends to warp the cylinders resulting in Head gasket failure. Closed deck can have cooling issues but doesnt have cylinder warpage issues under big boost.
* Swing arm HLA DOHC heads
This is a description of a cylinder head... its bolted to the block, where the valves and spark plugs and such are. Swing arm is the little...arm that the HLA( Hydraulic lash adjuster(hydraulic lifter)) DOHC is Dual over head cam... 2 cams run the valves. They are "over the head" as opposed to either OHV (over head valve) where the cam is found in the block, or flat head where the cam and valves are found in the block.
* Shortblock
Its the block.... Long block usually donates a "complete engine" minus accessories like the alt, compressor and such, but the long block has heads, cams, pistons, block, and sometimes mainfolds. Short block is the low end... the block, pistons, and crank... not much else, usually in one piece.
89 XT6 EZ30 powered
87 D/R Wagon w/ legacy seats :P
87 D/R Wagon w/ legacy seats :P
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RallyRS
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Thankx for that info!!!
So how would I know if my EJ20G is closed or open deck? If mine was open deck, what is the maximum boost I could run?
is "Swing arm HLA DOHC heads " the only type of head? are there better ones available? Does my EJ20G have these?
So long and short block could be the exactly the engine but assembled to different levels?
Sorry again. I'm slowly learning enough information to become anoying!
Regards
Hayden
So how would I know if my EJ20G is closed or open deck? If mine was open deck, what is the maximum boost I could run?
is "Swing arm HLA DOHC heads " the only type of head? are there better ones available? Does my EJ20G have these?
So long and short block could be the exactly the engine but assembled to different levels?
Sorry again. I'm slowly learning enough information to become anoying!
Regards
Hayden
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555BCTurbo
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Your motor, providing it is the original 1989 EJ20G is closed deck...
Your heads would also be swingarm if the motor is as aforementioned...
Yes, you are correct, long and shortblock are terms used to describe engines in different stages of completeness...not any particular engine.
Your heads would also be swingarm if the motor is as aforementioned...
Yes, you are correct, long and shortblock are terms used to describe engines in different stages of completeness...not any particular engine.
Nick
1987 Audi 4000CS quattro...soon to be 20VT
1994 Dodge Ram 2500 4x4 CTD, #11 plate, 30 psi, Scotty II intake, 4" exhaust
1987 Audi 4000CS quattro...soon to be 20VT
1994 Dodge Ram 2500 4x4 CTD, #11 plate, 30 psi, Scotty II intake, 4" exhaust
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Matt Monson
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Just one correction to add. Open Deck does not equal a weak block. All of the Subaru turbo engines built from '96-2000 were open deck, even STi ones. They can take a ton of boost. Really the only weak open deck Subaru Ej series engines are the Ej25's.
But this really is mute since your '89 should be a closed deck block. It can take 30+psi of boost. But finding a turbo that will deliver that will be the challenge. Take baby steps. Build your car up slowly. There's a lot you can do to your car before it comes time to change the turbo.
And the swing arm rockers and HLA's don't like to be revved much past 7000rpm. But it would be a real long time before you had your car built up to the point that you would need to rev beyond that...
But this really is mute since your '89 should be a closed deck block. It can take 30+psi of boost. But finding a turbo that will deliver that will be the challenge. Take baby steps. Build your car up slowly. There's a lot you can do to your car before it comes time to change the turbo.
And the swing arm rockers and HLA's don't like to be revved much past 7000rpm. But it would be a real long time before you had your car built up to the point that you would need to rev beyond that...
1974 Porsche 914 Cam Am Limted Edition AKA the Bumble Bee
1973 Porsche 914 2.0 l -Suby swap pending
1968 Porsche 911t survivor 47k original miles
2000 2.5RS daily driver.
1999 2.5RS w/ 50+ extra whp
Suby Hai!
1973 Porsche 914 2.0 l -Suby swap pending
1968 Porsche 911t survivor 47k original miles
2000 2.5RS daily driver.
1999 2.5RS w/ 50+ extra whp
Suby Hai!
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555BCTurbo
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RallyRS
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Thanks... thats awesome information! The Legacy is a rally car so have to have a 36mm restrictor which will stop any power at high revs anyways.
Revving is for Hondas. Sure is! This is going sound bad on this site but my road car is a 2000 Honda Accord Euro Type-R and it hauls! Not as quick as the Legacy but not far off, I say it would be quicker than a standard legacy. Helps when the engine pulls 9500rpm, with 220Hp standard. And the fuel ecomony fuel my Honda is amazing! 1000km on 40L, Legacy is about 400km on 40L.
Anyway, enough about the Honda. As cool as it is, it doesn't have a turbo. Just a nice, cheap to run street car.
Revving is for Hondas. Sure is! This is going sound bad on this site but my road car is a 2000 Honda Accord Euro Type-R and it hauls! Not as quick as the Legacy but not far off, I say it would be quicker than a standard legacy. Helps when the engine pulls 9500rpm, with 220Hp standard. And the fuel ecomony fuel my Honda is amazing! 1000km on 40L, Legacy is about 400km on 40L.
Anyway, enough about the Honda. As cool as it is, it doesn't have a turbo. Just a nice, cheap to run street car.
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555BCTurbo
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Hondas are great for daily drivers...what pisses me off is when people think they are the supreme car for everything... Go up against some STi's on the rally course in your Accord and see what happens!! haha 
Good luck with the Legacy btw!!
You are making me miss NZ!!
Good luck with the Legacy btw!!
You are making me miss NZ!!
Nick
1987 Audi 4000CS quattro...soon to be 20VT
1994 Dodge Ram 2500 4x4 CTD, #11 plate, 30 psi, Scotty II intake, 4" exhaust
1987 Audi 4000CS quattro...soon to be 20VT
1994 Dodge Ram 2500 4x4 CTD, #11 plate, 30 psi, Scotty II intake, 4" exhaust
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RallyRS
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I'm definitly a Subaru man, but expensive to drive everyday.
We have some hondas racing in the New Zealand Rally Championship and a Honda Jazz got second in one event. How embrassing! Bet heaps of WRXs and EVOs. It is not a standard Jazz, it has 2L interger Vtec engine at about 350Hp and 6 speed seqential (spelling???) gearbox, worth about $70k. Looks like shit bad goes pretty hard. FWD are actually pretty fast rally cars, just doesn't seem right to me. RWD is the best to watch, especially 70's BDA Ford escorts and RX7's!
I think more comes down to driver than car on the track!
NZ in mint man, I've done a bit of travelling and its always good to get home!
We have some hondas racing in the New Zealand Rally Championship and a Honda Jazz got second in one event. How embrassing! Bet heaps of WRXs and EVOs. It is not a standard Jazz, it has 2L interger Vtec engine at about 350Hp and 6 speed seqential (spelling???) gearbox, worth about $70k. Looks like shit bad goes pretty hard. FWD are actually pretty fast rally cars, just doesn't seem right to me. RWD is the best to watch, especially 70's BDA Ford escorts and RX7's!
I think more comes down to driver than car on the track!
NZ in mint man, I've done a bit of travelling and its always good to get home!
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555BCTurbo
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My uncle is building a 1971 Escort Rally car to run in the Dunlop Targa...
It will have a ~750hp Lexus Twin Turbo V8 in it...
I tell him that he is crazy putting down that much power in a rwd
It will have a ~750hp Lexus Twin Turbo V8 in it...
I tell him that he is crazy putting down that much power in a rwd
Nick
1987 Audi 4000CS quattro...soon to be 20VT
1994 Dodge Ram 2500 4x4 CTD, #11 plate, 30 psi, Scotty II intake, 4" exhaust
1987 Audi 4000CS quattro...soon to be 20VT
1994 Dodge Ram 2500 4x4 CTD, #11 plate, 30 psi, Scotty II intake, 4" exhaust
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RallyRS
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- Joined: Tue Nov 29, 2005 10:55 pm
- Location: Nelson, New Zealand
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What a animal that Excort will be! I gotta see it! Excorts rule! best Ford ever made.
I hoping to do the Dunlop Targa next year as well in the Legacy. Wont won, but be good fun!
They are starting a new endurance rally in the South Island. Called the "Silver Rern Rally" its a race from Blenheim to Queenstown over 7 days all on gravel. Great fun! I'm hoping to do that too.
I hoping to do the Dunlop Targa next year as well in the Legacy. Wont won, but be good fun!
They are starting a new endurance rally in the South Island. Called the "Silver Rern Rally" its a race from Blenheim to Queenstown over 7 days all on gravel. Great fun! I'm hoping to do that too.