Check Engine light on Motor running ruff

[CCorsair]

Hi last night my wife and I went out and after a late dinner we started to go off to get some thing from the store and the check engine light came on and there is sound like some thing is not running even and I also noted the main fan is not running as well.
I never noted that both fans were running just the middle one.

We have had some problems with the AC going out in high heat but the wagon it self has never shown signs of over heating .

Oil and all is at right levels and I not sure why or what is up.

Is there why to get the wagon to flash back acode with just turning the key on and off as in some cars?


It almost runs like one of the plugs was not firing but not as hard just a bit of wobble.

This is a 1990 Subaru Legacy L wagon.
I don't have any of the books so I guess I need to know if there is fuse that I should check first on the wagon for the fans.
I check belts all are ther and working.. there is a oil leak but the levels as i said are good so I not sure what it it from it isn't a big leak just enough to know it is there.

Any info would be of great help as i don't get paid for 2 weeks and I don't think i want to drive this any more till I can get some one to look at it .

Thanks and sorry i did search to see if some one had this problem but check engin has a lot of post.

CC

[Splinter]

http://legacycentral.org/library.htm

[CCorsair]

Ok well that shows I haven't been on the board for bit ..forgot the library area. Will go see if what I found helps but reading the library postings I thinking I'll get back the Knock sensor code as the edgine is running as it states in there.. And this would happen on Friday night and and Sat when all the good shops are closed in Sacramento area. gurrr.


Thanks any more input for others is still welcome.

CC

Edit to the above:

Looked for the area/box that was listed in the library for checking the engine codes ..to many wire that have been re-done.. looks like it a lost for checking codes unless I have a code checker to plug in. Checked all fuses and all look good .. can't tell on relays but there could be bad ones.

Note the main fan now comes on if i turn on the AC but the AC compressor Clutch does not engage it seem to be locked up.
Wile under the dash I noted a anothere blck box the is connected to the alarm system if i move it or tuch it a red light blinks. the wiring under the dash is a mess. some one really re-wired the system to this alarm and it could be just alost cause on fixing it with out a map of what they did and what should be there.

The engine : The main problem is that seem to be running on low power and out of balance it seem that it could not be firing on the #4 back cylinder or that the injector is not firing which i could check if I had a book and tools to do so.

Anyone local to the sac area that can work on this in trad for some computer work? Ok all thanks

Its not that being cheap its the weekend and no one is in their shops and I have to get this wagon back to running ASAP.


Thanks for helping and putting up with my ranting and yelling about this ...

CC

[bepa]

[quote="CCorsair"]Ok well that shows I haven't been on the board for bit ..forgot the library area. Will go see if what I found helps but reading the library postings I thinking I'll get back the Knock sensor code as the edgine is running as it states in there.. And this would happen on Friday night and and Sat when all the good shops are closed in Sacramento area. gurrr.


Thanks any more input for others is still welcome.

CC

Edit to the above:

Looked for the area/box that was listed in the library for checking the engine codes ..to many wire that have been re-done.. looks like it a lost for checking codes unless I have a code checker to plug in. Checked all fuses and all look good .. can't tell on relays but there could be bad ones.

Note the main fan now comes on if i turn on the AC but the AC compressor Clutch does not engage it seem to be locked up.
Wile under the dash I noted a anothere blck box the is connected to the alarm system if i move it or tuch it a red light blinks. the wiring under the dash is a mess. some one really re-wired the system to this alarm and it could be just alost cause on fixing it with out a map of what they did and what should be there.

The engine : The main problem is that seem to be running on low power and out of balance it seem that it could not be firing on the #4 back cylinder or that the injector is not firing which i could check if I had a book and tools to do so.

Anyone local to the sac area that can work on this in trad for some computer work? Ok all thanks

Its not that being cheap its the weekend and no one is in their shops and I have to get this wagon back to running ASAP.


Thanks for helping and putting up with my ranting and yelling about this ...

CC[/quote]

with the car cold, check the water/anti freeze level. then check the level in the overflow tank. like you were thinking, check all the plug wires. with car running remove one wire at a time. next if you know which wire it is disconnect the o2 sensor. it should raise the idle. if nothing it may be bad.

a/c not kicking in, possible low on freon gas. you could jump out the pressure sensor on the low side to get compressor to kick in to see if in fact the compressor is bad. do not do it for long unless adding freon gas. it will need r12 freon unless changing over fittings and using 134. next a big job to change over,
before buying anything check to see if you don't have a bad coil pack. check to see if each coil pack has power and has a spark to both spark plugs.

look they are all things that you can do for free. what can it hurt to try!

be well, safe driving and keep the faith, you can do this.
p.s. I believe if you look around the steering column you should find two blue (may be another color,think it is a) wires connect them, start car read code numbers (long/short flashs ) of check engine light. and don't worry it may take a couple of times before you get them, if there are a few. good luck.

[CCorsair]

with the car cold, check the water/anti freeze level. then check the level in the overflow tank. like you were thinking, check all the plug wires. with car running remove one wire at a time. next if you know which wire it is disconnect the o2 sensor. it should raise the idle. if nothing it may be bad.

a/c not kicking in, possible low on freon gas. you could jump out the pressure sensor on the low side to get compressor to kick in to see if in fact the compressor is bad. do not do it for long unless adding freon gas. it will need r12 freon unless changing over fittings and using 134. next a big job to change over,
before buying anything check to see if you don't have a bad coil pack. check to see if each coil pack has power and has a spark to both spark plugs.

look they are all things that you can do for free. what can it hurt to try!

be well, safe driving and keep the faith, you can do this.
p.s. I believe if you look around the steering column you should find two blue (may be another color,think it is a) wires connect them, start car read code numbers (long/short flashs ) of check engine light. and don't worry it may take a couple of times before you get them, if there are a few. good luck.

Did most of what you sad today and all still could not figure out which wire is what but from the fact that some screws are missing from the bottem of the dash cover that some one been under here a few times as well. I got a message from one of the people on one of the other Forum borads and he gave me both the Chilton and Haynes books for the Subaru so I know have something help to ID the wires and what I am looking at under the dash and hood.

Coolent levelsare good but It could be that the AC is dead due to it need to be recharges.. do not know if it was changed over to the new stuff but I will say that some of the sensors have been replaced as they look very new.
I should be up early before it gets hot to look at the wiring and see if i can get the code for what ever is going on as this is driving me nuts. this is our only working car so having it go down isn making the wife happy as well...That Alone is getting me on the ball in getting to the bottem of the problem.

Ok thanks all

CC

[bepa]

[quote="CCorsair"][quote="bepa"]
with the car cold, check the water/anti freeze level. then check the level in the overflow tank. like you were thinking, check all the plug wires. with car running remove one wire at a time. next if you know which wire it is disconnect the o2 sensor. it should raise the idle. if nothing it may be bad.

a/c not kicking in, possible low on freon gas. you could jump out the pressure sensor on the low side to get compressor to kick in to see if in fact the compressor is bad. do not do it for long unless adding freon gas. it will need r12 freon unless changing over fittings and using 134. next a big job to change over,
before buying anything check to see if you don't have a bad coil pack. check to see if each coil pack has power and has a spark to both spark plugs.

look they are all things that you can do for free. what can it hurt to try!

be well, safe driving and keep the faith, you can do this.
p.s. I believe if you look around the steering column you should find two blue (may be another color,think it is a) wires connect them, start car read code numbers (long/short flashs ) of check engine light. and don't worry it may take a couple of times before you get them, if there are a few. good luck.[/quote]


Did most of what you sad today and all still could not figure out which wire is what but from the fact that some screws are missing from the bottem of the dash cover that some one been under here a few times as well. I got a message from one of the people on one of the other Forum borads and he gave me both the Chilton and Haynes books for the Subaru so I know have something help to ID the wires and what I am looking at under the dash and hood.

Coolent levelsare good but It could be that the AC is dead due to it need to be recharges.. do not know if it was changed over to the new stuff but I will say that some of the sensors have been replaced as they look very new.
I should be up early before it gets hot to look at the wiring and see if i can get the code for what ever is going on as this is driving me nuts. this is our only working car so having it go down isn making the wife happy as well...That Alone is getting me on the ball in getting to the bottem of the problem.

Ok thanks all

CC[/quote]

wish I had more for you. one thing if new 134 was put in usually you will find new fitting on top of freon fitting. it would be on a/c lines. check for the larger size line. this is the low pressure side. it is where you would add the freon. good luck. about the wires they would look like they should be connected. once connected check for a flashing check engine light. count flashs. long then short.

[Manarius]

The connectors are green and black. Plug the black "single" one into the green receiver and turn on the car to "On" and start writing.

[CCorsair]

The connectors are green and black. Plug the black "single" one into the green receiver and turn on the car to "On" and start writing.

Ok will be trying again on Monday(later this morining)

I gone over both manuals and looking at the trouble shooting section I got to thinking this looks like multi-leve problem.

One: The light came on and the engin is running uneven like it is not firing fully but it is starting good.

Two: The main electric engine fan will not start as it has been doing unless I turn on the AC. the AC Cluch on the compressor does not start up but this is been going since the high heat hit.
Could all of this be a relay or fuse?

Third: Another thing is that we have had problems with the gas gauge has been actting up as well we will fill the tank but after a few stops the gauge drop to E and the back up and bounces about from full to half full till we fill the tank again. People say it just a sensor but could it part of this problem?

Once I get the code to flash back I set but what if it shows something that has nothing to do with the problem?

Also How do I get that Plastic cover off the center area on the engine? none of the book cover how it is to be removed and i don't want to break it.

Ok will let you all know what I fine out If anything i may just drive carefuly to an Autozone as i hear the do free scans. I just don't like driving the wagon with it acting like this more than Ineed to.

Ok thanks all

CC

PS I have some spark plugs here I wonder if will work with the Subarus they are Bosh Platinum +4 #4478 R3 I got them for a Mazda we have that is now dead. I never took them back and well if this a bad plug it would be nice that something i have would work.

[Manarius]

I'll go over this a step at a time:

Fans: I wonder if you have a cooked Thermostat. The Thermostat determines whether the engine fans go on to aid in cooling.

Gas Gauge: Irrelevant to your problem. The gauge sender on the fuel pump itself is worn out, which is why the gauge is wacky.

Checking codes: Write down all the codes anyways. We can throw some out if necessary. And, if we're still confused, we can reset the ECU and get it to throw codes again and it'll be clean (ie, the codes thrown will only be the ones relevant).

Removing the cover: Just pull straight up on the cover. It's pretty durable, but it may require a little jarring to get it out.

[quicklook]

so your car is running wacky.

you have quoted so many posts that i do not know what is what.

and now you want to take used bosch crappy platinum plugs from a mazda so you can save a buck.

good luck!

[Manarius]

and now you want to take used bosch crappy platinum plugs from a mazda so you can save a buck.

good luck!

Easy there. Don't go knocking plugs until you have them in your car. I have happen to have Bosch 4+'s and love them.

[quicklook]

i have tried the original single bosch platinums, lasted 1 month before fouling out, no other plugs ever did in this vehicle, ford 390 ci.

then tried dual platinums in my saab turbo they lasted less than a week, no problem any other plugs.

tried 4-platinums in a corvette, fouled out in a day, no other problems from any other plugs. i got bosch to give me my money back on those.

so i think i can say that bosch platinum plugs are crap if i want to.

just as you can like them, i can hate them.

plus this guy is asking to try used bosch plugs from a mazda in his subaru that does not run right already, and that is just plain crazy.

[CCorsair]

i have tried the original single bosch platinums, lasted 1 month before fouling out, no other plugs ever did in this vehicle, ford 390 ci.

then tried dual platinums in my saab turbo they lasted less than a week, no problem any other plugs.

tried 4-platinums in a corvette, fouled out in a day, no other problems from any other plugs. i got bosch to give me my money back on those.

so i think i can say that bosch platinum plugs are crap if i want to.

just as you can like them, i can hate them.

plus this guy is asking to try used bosch plugs from a mazda in his subaru that does not run right already, and that is just plain crazy.

Was only asking if the plugs were good to use if once i got the code to flash and it showed that is could be a plug..

Thanks will try to get my money back on the plugs then if they are that bad.

Thanks

CC

[CCorsair]

Ok I got the codes and the wires that had to connected look nothing like what every one said but for they did look like one of the drawing in one of the books.


I video taped the codes and may post a link as soon as I get them up for other check if i got the codes flash to me right but my wife and I watched it 3 time and we get these codes.

11
16
32
35

Books say
11 Crank sensor
16 fuel inector #3 <--- this fits as the engine is running as if the injector or plug on that side was off.
32 O2 sensor
35 Purge control solrmid valva

I thinking that if the injector is bad could it throw the rest off?

Anyway not the fun part is to get to the injector and check the wiring and then the injector.

I have the video of the code flash it run about 2mins or more and I let it run the codes a few times.




as I said this what have to deal with




more wires




the test wires...



this is how the alarm is wired





As you can see this isn't the best wiring job I seen and done much better. I made classic Chevy wiring harness sets from wiring boards.



Thanks all for putting up with my messy post also
I just need to get this fixed.
Did talk to one person they think it the code 11 causing all along with the #32 O3 sensor.

Please watch the video and let me know if I got the code right

Thanks

CC

[quicklook]

Was only asking if the plugs were good to use if once i got the code to flash and it showed that is could be a plug..

Thanks will try to get my money back on the plugs then if they are that bad.

Thanks

CC[/quote]

you want to use plug 4478 r3 bosch and the subaru uses

Bosch Platinum+4;
Part Number: 4417

Engine: H4 2.2 Liter FI
Spark Plug: Platinum+4; EJ22;


so no they would not be good to try in your subaru.

[CCorsair]

CC

you want to use plug 4478 r3 bosch and the subaru uses

Bosch Platinum+4;
Part Number: 4417

Engine: H4 2.2 Liter FI
Spark Plug: Platinum+4; EJ22;


so no they would not be good to try in your subaru.[/quote]

Thank jusr wanted to know if they would work as I never got to install them so they are new and all. But not having the books till now I know what # plugs i need to work with now.

Now just need to make sure i have read the codes right and get this wagon rolling again..

CC

[quicklook]

after you find out why the injector #3 is not working you will be well on your way to solving this.

good luck.

[CCorsair]

after you find out why the injector #3 is not working you will be well on your way to solving this.

good luck.

After talking to a shop they think its the Crank sensor as they said the injectors are hard to kill. Plus the O2 sensor may need chaging..

Thay said aboyt $143-45 to fix and about 45 mins or so.. not back but checks are a week out unless I can get computer recovery jobs.

I have a friend going out of town and he said he will lend me one of his cars for few weeks so I'll be able to get out and work if I get a calls.

I hate when things like this happen when funds are weeks away.

Gurr..

Thanks

CC

[quicklook]

i would fix injector before i did anything.

[CCorsair]

i would fix injector before i did anything.

I am going to check it as well but calling shop that does nothing but Subarus they said that with the codes I think I have it is more likely the crank sensor and that Fuel Injector is problem could be just from the one. so what ask is about right one problem causing 4 codes could be it.

If any one get something from the codes flash let me know as I posted the video to help make sure I got the right codes.

Ok thanks

CC

[Legacy777]

I got the same codes as you.

Reset the ECU, drive the car around, and see what codes come back before you do anything.

I will forewarn you that others have had issues resetting the ECU when the canister purge solenoid is bad. Don't ask me why, but they have.

[CCorsair]

I got the same codes as you.

Reset the ECU, drive the car around, and see what codes come back before you do anything. BTW if you note in the pics I don't have the wires that they talk about in the Library ECU doc. No Green connector so do i use the same wires for testing or just do the battary disconnect?


I will forewarn you that others have had issues resetting the ECU when the canister purge solenoid is bad. Don't ask me why, but they have.

Ok good I just want to know if I got the codes right.

I still think the injector my self but I think I'll do the battary disconnect and re-set to see what codes come back not that know what to look for.

any one know what part cost I am looking at? I know thO@ sensor is hard to get at but if i read the books right the rest are not as hard. I talk with a friend he has an Ultrasonic cleaner
I can use to clean the injectors if need. He works on airplan engines a nd knows more than me I just know electronic and computers and know enough about car to get by.

Again sorry if confused people with my post but I need to get this wagon back and running and this one place I know people can get get good help.

Ok thanks all

CC

[CCorsair]

Ok clear all the code but #16 which is the #3 injector.

Should i try pulling and cleaning or just replace and what cost am i looking at?

Also the main cooling fan still only kicks in if i hit the AC which we thing is dead due to a leak.

Ok thanks

CC

[Legacy777]

If you're getting a code, cleaning won't do anything. The electrical part is what's bad.

Post and see if anyone has a used injector. Is your car AT or MT? I think I still have my AT injectors....If I have them I'll sell ya all four for pretty reasonable price. If you need something ASAP, you may want to ask blackbart or post, since I'm going to be out of town for the next week or so.

Fix the injector, and we'll worry about the fans afterwards.

[CCorsair]

If you're getting a code, cleaning won't do anything. The electrical part is what's bad.

Post and see if anyone has a used injector. Is your car AT or MT? I think I still have my AT injectors....If I have them I'll sell ya all four for pretty reasonable price. If you need something ASAP, you may want to ask blackbart or post, since I'm going to be out of town for the next week or so.

Fix the injector, and we'll worry about the fans afterwards.

The wagon is 1990 Subaru Legacy L Wagon AWD Automatic Transmission 16valve MPFI I not sure the lite specs but I do have pics of the wagon in the photo section on this site.

Email me or PM if you want to talk deal I still looking at why the injector went out as having more than one thing electrical go out makes me thing the injector could be giving a false info to the main computer on this as well.


Also after clearing the cody everything ran better but started to run ruff and just run the one code for the injector. Tried some injector cleaner to see if it was a cloged port but we been running good gas with no cheap stuff with out some kind of addtive.



looking at how the injectors are it looks like I would have to take both on tha side off and that is after I get the fuel pressure taken off the engine to do so.
Also do I need or should I replace all at one time?
I think I just may have shop install but i will do my best to find a good price on the injectors.

They seem to be good on their cost for doing the work I just don't have a lot of the tools and my one friend that could help is going out of town to Hawii for a week.

Thanks again for help

CC
PS you can find me on Skype under Greene_Consulting if you want talk more on the injector.